Interview with Willi Schulz, Gruppe Arbeiter:innenmacht, German Section of the L5I
The following interview was originally published by Robert Narai from Socialist Alternative (Australia). Last month, Willi Schulz was in Melbourne to present a series of talks at the Marxism Conference. We thank the comrades of Socialist Alternative for the invitation, their hospitality and the fruitful and inspiring discussions at and around the conference.
German politics has shifted sharply to the right following the federal election in February. Former corporate lawyer and multi-millionaire Friedrich Merz will now lead a conservative coalition government after the collapse of the previous “green light” coalition of Social Democrats, Liberals and Greens. The far-right Alternative für Deutschland achieved its best election result ever, coming second, amid mass anti-fascist demonstrations and a surge in support for the left-wing party Die Linke.
Could you start by outlining the main features of the crisis of European and German imperialism in which the far-right has been able to grow?
To understand the rise of the far right, we must understand the specific features of the European Union (EU) in times of intensified struggle for the reorganisation of the world. Geopolitically, the EU remains a minor power compared to the other imperialist powers, such as the US and China, which are now locked in a competition for global supremacy, and Russia, which it sees as a competitor.
The EU is the third attempt by German imperialism to secure its place in the sun, co-led by French imperialism. However, to this day, it has failed because it is not a coherent state but an alliance of states with their own ruling capitalist factions and interests. Attempts to build ties through transnational capital, such as Airbus, have not been able to compensate for this. The EU, as an imperialist project, is the weakest link in the imperialist chain.
The neoliberal constitution of the EU, designed to get rid of the last elements of welfare state policy, has exposed the EU as undemocratic and aggressively neoliberal, which is being used by the far right to pit their nation against the EU elites.
The consequences of the 2007-08 financial crisis were imposed on the weak states through austerity policies. Large parts of southern Europe were impoverished, while in the north they were labelled lazy and unproductive. Chauvinism against the PIIGS (Portugal, Ireland, Italy, Greece, Spain) was stoked. To this day, the EU has not been able to recover politically and economically. This is a strategic weakness for Germany and France.
The class struggles in Greece and the capitulation of the left-wing Syriza government were a historic defeat for the European labour movement and represent demoralisation.
The suffocation of the Arab Spring and the so-called refugee crisis that followed have divided Europe. The EU responded with isolationism and Fortress Europe, most recently in the form of the Common European Asylum System (CEAS) and the EU-Turkey deal. State racism is already on the rise, justified as a way of weakening the right wing, while in reality they just intensify each other.
As the leading nation of the EU, German imperialism is not only a military lightweight; the end of globalisation presents it with massive economic challenges. Carried by global supply chains, capital and goods exports to most of the world, and formerly heavily dependent on Russian gas, the German economy has been thrown into shock. The attack of Russian imperialism on Ukraine was a global political turning point. Immediately afterwards, then-Chancellor Olaf Scholz proclaimed a “turning point” and with it a $100 billion arms package.
The European rearmament program of Merz and von der Leyen, spurred on by Trump, represents an attempt to overcome the weaknesses of German imperialism.
This is the terrain on which to understand the rise of the far right: a strategic crisis of the ruling class, an undemocratic EU, the rise of nationalism, scapegoating of refugees, internal chauvinism and a failure of the workers’ movement.
Who are the far-right Alternative für Deutschland (AfD)? How has this crisis helped facilitate their growth?
The AfD emerged in 2013 as a Euro-critical party that wanted a strong currency for the German market. It represented a break from the ranks of the conservative party, which historically had been a compromise between different factions of capital, a compromise that seemed to have broken down and which they wanted to break from. During the so-called refugee crisis, the right wing of the party, which has a fascist core, grew stronger and has been growing steadily ever since. It now makes up about three-fifths of the party membership and continues to grow.
The AfD has about 53,000 members. Since its secret 2023 conference in Potsdam, it has gained at least 13,000 new members.
The AfD first ran in the federal elections in 2017, achieving 12.6 percent, 10.4 percent in 2021, and now 20.8 percent in 2025. In the latest poll, it stands at 24.5 percent. What is particularly dramatic is that it has not only won over small business owners and some of the middle class, but has also scored well above average among people in poor economic situations (39 percent), blue-collar workers (38 percent) and the unemployed (34 percent). It also became the second strongest party among young voters (18 to 24 years old). Trade union members voted 23.2 percent for the mainstream conservatives, 21.8 percent for the AfD, and only 20.6 percent for the Social Democratic Party (SPD).
It has been able to grow due to disillusionment with the mainstream conservative party (CDU/CSU) and the SPD. Their policies of refugee-bashing, militarised borders and law and order are increasingly adopted by the mainstream parties and help legitimise them as a false opposition to the establishment.
The strategic reorientation of the bourgeoisie and the organisation of a party in which fascist forces can grow is what characterises the AfD. With the joint anti-migration vote together with the CDU/CSU and other parties at the end of January 2025, it showed that it is prepared to stand as a kind of shadow coalition for the conservatives if the Social Democrats are not ready for their fundamental attack on the working class. The support from the US administration, whether it be Musk speaking at the party conference or J.D. Vance supporting the European right at the Munich Security Conference, shows that they are increasingly being seen as an option. However, due to its opposition to the strategy of German monopoly capital (the EU), it is still not considered a reliable partner.
On the streets, however, the AfD is far from being a purely right-wing populist force, but rather a gathering place for reactionary and fascist currents. Since the federal elections alone, the number of open attacks on leftists and migrants has increased. There have also been armed attacks on refugee shelters. Fascists are marching openly again, something that had declined sharply since the emergence of the AfD.
The AfD has not yet fulfilled its historical mission, but it stands ready. Its inclusion in a possible federal government would certainly mean a split in the party, but also a reorientation of German politics and, with it, of Germany’s relationship to the EU. But to do so, it would have to break with its strategic orientation toward Russian imperialism.
The new government will be another grand coalition, this time led by the ultra-conservative Friedrich Merz. What is their program?
The previous government—the “traffic light coalition” of Social Democrats, Liberals and Greens— fell apart over the question of a strategy for German imperialism in times of heightened crisis. They could not agree on the amount of debt required to remilitarise Germany. Merz has already faced opposition from within the ranks of the new coalition; for the first time in German history, the initial vote failed to inaugurate him as chancellor. It shows how weak this new coalition government is already.
Merz faces the problem of having to lead a period of open rivalry with the US. His government’s program is characterised by making Germany fit for war, strengthening its own authoritarianism in “defence” of democracy, expanding a massive racist deportation regime, and pushing ahead with historic cuts and privatisations to strengthen its own ruling class.
In terms of the question of the massive rearmament of German imperialism, they have cancelled the debt brake so that the German state is allowed to have unlimited debt to rearm itself. They want to spend 3.5 percent of GDP on the military, which is three times more than just 10 years ago. They are trying to expand the German armed forces by reintroducing a “voluntary” form of compulsory military service. They are supporting an EU nuclear rearmament program.
They want to see if they can solve the crisis of the car industry by transforming individual Volkswagen factories into producing tanks. At the moment, the German state is already producing more artillery munition than the US.
They want to sell off infrastructure and state property to revitalise German capital. Eight percent of public sector staff will be cut, but not in the security agencies. Then there is the so-called investment program where 500 billion will be spent over the next 12 years. This will be put into the investment of private capital to make it more competitive. Companies will be able to write off 30 percent of their investments to be refunded after their tax return. The corporate tax rate is to be reduced. Environmental standards are to be reduced.
The new government wants to completely abolish the right to asylum. They have proposed a mass deportation campaign of refugees to Syria and Afghanistan. They want to deny the right for legal support for refugees in their trials against their deportation so they cannot defend themselves in the courts. They want to introduce a card payment system so they can financially control what refugees can and cannot do. This will be accompanied by increasing demonisation of Arabs as a source of violence through so-called “Israel-related antisemitism”.
They want to massively attack traditional working-class rights by getting rid of the eight-hour day and changing it into a 42-hour maximum work week where there is no maximum daily work amount. They want to abolish the Bürgergeld (unemployment benefit) and reintroduce a sanctions system. They also want to increase the pool of unemployed workers by giving retirees the option to work longer for lesser taxation.
The incoming attacks on the labour movement are linked to restrictions on democratic rights. For example, massive criminalisation of the environmental movement and solidarity with Palestine. These attacks are defended as necessary to protect democracy from external enemies such as China and Russia.
The trade unions have welcomed aspects of the government’s statements (investment program), are demanding co-management of certain areas (AI in the workplace) and remain silent on other issues (militarisation, deportation). Their connection to the SPD makes them guarantees of social peace and demobilisation for the ruling class.
The AfD will benefit most from this state of affairs. We can already see that in the Bundestagswahl (federal election) results for 2025. The AfD have already increased their popularity relative to the conservative party in the latest poll. This is before the new government had even formed.
Polarisation to the right is not the only dynamic at play in Germany. What does the polarisation to the left look like?
Since 2023, millions of people have taken to the streets against the AfD.
The initial protests were in response to the 2023 Potsdam conference of fascists, members of the AfD (some of them also fascists) and also members of the conservative party who were revealed to have been discussing a program of “re-immigration” (deportation) of German migrant citizens. These were the strongest anti-racist and anti-fascist mobilisations in over a decade. Millions of people were in the streets, not just in the urban centres but in rural areas as well.
Earlier this year, there were demonstrations of millions against the breaking of the “fire wall” around the fascists: the conservative party tried using the votes of the AfD to pass an immigration bill.
There have also been mass blockades of AfD party meetings. Last June, 70,000 people participated in a huge demonstration against the AfD party meeting in Essen. The movement has also made its way onto university campuses and is very active.
But the movement is making a moral argument that “you shall not be racist; you shall not be fascist.” It is not challenging the overall program. It is not challenging anti-migration policy, and on the question of Palestine, it’s weak.
This polarisation has also expressed itself in the Bundestag [German parliament]. Die Linke, a reformist party which, until recently, was in crisis, has been the only party that has stood in opposition to the politics of the far right.
It has attracted 60,000 new members who see the party as the focal point for opposition to the incoming attacks of the coalition government and against the rise of the AfD. It has been students and mainly young women who have joined and massively changed the character of the party. Its vote doubled in the last election and won 8.7 percent. Now, tens of thousands are getting active and want to fight. They challenge the rise of the far-right on campuses. They mobilise against meetings of the AfD. One of their members in the Bundestag called on demonstrators to “join the barricades” during the recent mass demonstrations. They are a factor on the streets.
At the same time, it fights for the expansion of the welfare state, redistribution, disarmament and pacifism (instead of revolutionary anti-militarism). This corresponds to the prevailing consciousness. It is a reformist force and ultimately a bourgeois program within the labour movement. It focuses on social issues rents, and the rising cost of living.
It is passive on other issues. It does not see anti-racism and anti-fascism as part of the class struggle. It rejects the idea of open borders. It remains silent on the reactionary deal on Ukraine and is divided and paralysed on the issue of Palestine. It expelled the anti-Zionist Ramsis Kiliani from its ranks. In the second chamber (Bundesrat), it voted for rearmament and the investment program, thereby giving the incoming government a free pass. It supported a second vote to inaugurate Merz as chancellor.
The 60,000 new members mentioned above have also shifted the balance between the party’s wings. There is a right wing that fights for stability and hopes to form government with the Social Democrats. Then there is a left-wing that is connected to the new, activist base. The leadership believes it can take hold of the state machinery and wield it for socialist purposes. But as we know from history, this program is doomed to fail.
This is the core problem, because the politics of Die Linke are no less wrong than when it was founded. As a party, it does not want to smash capitalism, but to soften its excesses. The question arises, for example, whether it wants to govern or organise resistance. At the same time, its members expect opposition to the government and the AfD. This is where the real value of the party lies.
What are the tasks for revolutionaries in Germany today?
The main task of revolutionaries is the struggle for revolutionary class consciousness. This means helping organise resistance against the new grand coalition led by Merz. It is the Merz government and its attacks on working class and oppressed people that will help fuel the growth of the far right. At the same time, we have to relate to the people who have been radicalised by the struggle against the far right and convince them of revolutionary politics.
All these struggles are in resistance to the attacks of the ruling class and its murderous gangs on the streets, but as revolutionaries we cannot just fight the excesses of capitalist oppression. We must link these struggles in the building of a revolutionary party. The development of a program that starts from the central struggles and dominant consciousness of the fighting sections of the working class and shows the necessity of smashing the capitalist order, which is irreconcilable with it.
We must be the dagger in the back of our ruling class.